SU Podium Forum
Register  |   |   |  Calendar  |  Latest Topics
 
 
 


Reply
  Author   Comment  
Sipmasternasty

Registered:
Posts: 5
Reply with quote  #1 
Hi, 

I am wondering if anyone is experiencing the same problem as me, or if anyone has some advice of what to do?

I have been trying to render an environment, there is quite a few imported models from the Podium Browser, but not an excessive amount and nothing out the norm. I can render this particular scene on an interior preview setting, but when I try to render in high quality, the system crashes. This is after the scene processes and usually gets to raytracing. The system error that I keep getting is DPC_WATCHDOG_VIOLATION.

I have looked into this error and it seems like it is a problem with Windows itself. The suggestion was to update the drivers, which I already had the latest update. If the problem still exists (which it did), to do a full system reset (which I did). 

No the problem hasn't gone away. I am wondering if it really is a Windows problem, or a problem with the hardware I have. This workstation is only a month old (see spec below). I have the model analysis if anyone can take a look and see if theres a problem there (i can't seem to attach it), or whether the workstation spec just isn't enough for that size of model?

Any help would be much appreciated as this is doing my head in now... 

Thanks

PSU

EVGA 500W 80+

MOBO

Asus X99A- II

CPU

i7 6900K 8 cores 16Threads OC 4.2Ghz

CPU Cooler

Performance CPU Cooler

Memory

32GB DDR4 Memory

SSD

250GB Hynix SSD

HDD

1TB 7200RPM HDD

Graphics 1

Nvidia Quadro P1000 4GB Vram

OS

Windows 10 64bit

bigstick

Avatar / Picture

Moderator
Registered:
Posts: 10,106
Reply with quote  #2 
Run Podium Tools, copy the output, and paste it in a post. Or alternatively, upload a screenshot (Windows Snipping Tool is best for this) and attach it.

System specs are not useful other than to assess if the hardware is capable of rendering your file.

With fault diagnosis, the best thing is to start with a process of elimination. Can you render any SU file, or is it a problem with just one specific file?

This will tell us if the problem is in the file itself.

We need to try to identify if the problem is with the file, Podium, an SU plugin conflict, or a Windows configuration problem.

One useful way of diagnosing the fault, is to create a new user profile, and install SU and Podium on that for testing. That should give you a 'clean' environment for testing. If it works, there is a problem with your particular user configuration. If not, there is some sort of system conflict. 

__________________

That which does not kill us makes us stronger
-Friedrich Nietzsche

pmolson

Avatar / Picture

Registered:
Posts: 415
Reply with quote  #3 
I battled with this several months ago.

There are unfortunately a number of reasons it can be happening.

For me it was the driver for my gtx 1080 gpu. Windows 10 thought it was doing me a favor updating the driver to the latest and greatest, but that is what caused the issue.
I had to role the driver back.

I  have since then updated the driver to the current, bypassing the one that caused the problem, and everything is running fine.

I know some people have traced it to the sound portion of the gpu and have disabled that in order to solve.

Very frustrating. 

All I can really offer is the encouragement to keep digging.

__________________
pmo
Sipmasternasty

Registered:
Posts: 5
Reply with quote  #4 
Thank you for your responses. I have attached the analysis below, and I will try both of your suggestions.

I have tried rendering less complex models, and it seemed to be fine, but I haven't created that many models on this workstation yet, as it is only a month old. 

Ill let you know how I get on with your ideas. 

SU Podium model analysis:


SUMMARY
========================
Light Sources:
 26 point lights, 0 are turned off. 
 0 spot lights, 0 are turned off. 
 0 LEM material
      0 Normal LEM
      0 Hidden LEM
      0 High Intensity LEM

Materials:
 0 light-emitting materials(LEM) 
 126 reflective materials
 5 materials with refraction

Alerts:
 0 DTR problems
 0 unexploded images
 0 psd materials
 0 no extension texture
 0 wrong extension
 0 materials with Both LEM and reflection (can crash)
 0 High Intensity LEM applied to materials (may crash)


DETAILS
=================
Materials Details:
Reflective Materials:
   "PDM_Steel_brushed" used in 57732 faces
   "PDM_Oak_02" used in 8126 faces
   "PDM_Window_pane" used in 475 faces
   "Material1" used in 697 faces
   "[0130_Gainsboro]" used in 17 faces
   "PDM_Wood_08" used in 475 faces
   "glass_thin_01" used in 8 faces
   "PDM_Door_09_material_02" used in 732 faces
   "PDM_Door_09_material_03" used in 1458 faces
   "PDM_Door_09_material_05" used in 2 faces
   "PDM_Door_09_material_04" used in 2 faces
   "PDM_Door_09_material_01" used in 3 faces
   "PDM_Door_10_material_05" used in 2 faces
   "PDM_Door_10_material_04" used in 2 faces
   "PDM_Door_10_material_03" used in 2 faces
   "PDM_Dupont_Corian_Witch_hazel" used in 308 faces
   "PDM_Dupont_Corian_Bone" used in 998 faces
   "PDM_Plastic_orange_02" used in 6 faces
   "Polished Concrete" used in 21 faces
   "Grey Gloss" used in 153 faces
   "PDM Stainless steel" used in 564 faces
   "PDM_Door_08_material_07" used in 4432 faces
   "PDM_Door_08_material_08" used in 48 faces
   "PDM_Door_08_material_02" used in 12 faces
   "PDM_Door_08_material_06" used in 4 faces
   "PDM_Door_08_material_05" used in 4 faces
   "PDM_Door_08_material_04" used in 4 faces
   "PDM_Tile_02" used in 4 faces
   "PDM_Fireplace_Focus_Metafocus_1_Material_02" used in 117 faces
   "PDM_Fireplace_Focus_Metafocus_1_Material_08" used in 1 face
   "PDM_Wood_planks_02" used in 6 faces
   "PDM_LG_65in_Class_OLED_2160p_Smart_4K_Ultra_HD_TV_Material_12" used in 485 faces
   "PDM_LG_65in_Class_OLED_2160p_Smart_4K_Ultra_HD_TV_Material_04" used in 352 faces
   "PDM_LG_65in_Class_OLED_2160p_Smart_4K_Ultra_HD_TV_Material_08" used in 244 faces
   "PDM_LG_65in_Class_OLED_2160p_Smart_4K_Ultra_HD_TV_Material_09" used in 2211 faces
   "PDM_LG_65in_Class_OLED_2160p_Smart_4K_Ultra_HD_TV_Material_11" used in 629 faces
   "PDM_LG_65in_Class_OLED_2160p_Smart_4K_Ultra_HD_TV_Material_06" used in 1 face
   "Material3" used in 213 faces
   "PDM_Wood_veneer_03_Beech" used in 419 faces
   "Material2" used in 365 faces
   "PDM_Mesh_04" used in 2 faces
   "Grey Black Paint Finish" used in 480 faces
   "PDM_Dupont_Corian_Natural_gray" used in 22 faces
   "PDM_Kohler_Vault_3839_chrome" used in 643 faces
   "PDM Stainless steel1" used in 3441 faces
   "PDM Ventilation Hood_GE_Monogram" used in 1 face
   "PDM Chrome" used in 881 faces
   "PDM_Kohler_Purist_7548_4_faucet_chrome" used in 4075 faces
   "PDM_Dupont_Corian_Flint" used in 6 faces
   "PDM_Dupont_Corian_Dove" used in 6 faces
   "PDM_Dupont_Corian_Deep_sea" used in 6 faces
   "PDM_Dupont_Corian_Medea" used in 6 faces
   "cooktop_comp_2_3_4" used in 819 faces
   "cooktop_comp_5" used in 186 faces
   "cooktop_comp_1" used in 120 faces
   "PDM Cast iron Stairs_01" used in 972 faces
   "PDM_Zuo_Modern_Pure_Copper_1_Light_Pendant_Material_03" used in 543 faces
   "PDM_Zuo_Modern_Pure_Copper_1_Light_Pendant_Material_01" used in 2886 faces
   "PDM_Zuo_Modern_Pure_Copper_1_Light_Pendant_Material_02" used in 2793 faces
   "PDM_Dining_Assembly_04_Material_06" used in 11088 faces
   "PDM_Harbour_Outdoor_Breeze_Armchair_Material_01" used in 56 faces
   "PDM_Harbour_Outdoor_Breeze_Armchair_Material_03" used in 1022 faces
   "PDM_Harbour_Outdoor_Breeze_Armchair_Material_04" used in 70 faces
   "PDM_Pine_02" used in 6 faces
   "PDM_Wood_06" used in 6 faces
   "PDM_Lf_Cooper_Paint_Grey" used in 3840 faces
   "PDM_Lf_Cooper_Black_Metallic_Paint" used in 7696 faces
   "PDM_Lf_Cooper_Copper" used in 4767 faces
   "PDM_Lf_Cooper_Chrome" used in 1855 faces
   "PDM_Lf_Cooper_Glass" used in 7 faces
   "PDM_Arizona_Leather_Barrington_Sofa_Material_07" used in 1848 faces
   "PDM_Arizona_Leather_Barrington_Sofa_Material_06" used in 2944 faces
   "PDM_Arizona_Leather_Barrington_Sofa_Material_09" used in 8742 faces
   "PDM_Arizona_Leather_Barrington_Sofa_Material_03" used in 7689 faces
   "PDM_Arizona_Leather_Barrington_Sofa_Material_05" used in 85 faces
   "PDM_Arizona_Leather_Barrington_Sofa_Material_04" used in 110 faces
   "PDM_Arizona_Leather_Barrington_Sofa_Material_08" used in 550 faces
   "PDM_Arizona_Leather_Barrington_Sofa_Material_10" used in 820 faces
   "PDM_Arizona_Leather_Barrington_Sofa_Material_01" used in 2432 faces
   "PDM_Arizona_Leather_Barrington_Sofa_Material_02" used in 2840 faces
   "PDM COR Grey metal" used in 318 faces
   "PDM COR Wood 02" used in 186 faces
   "PDM_CB2_SAIC_Quantam_Leather_Rocking_Chair_Material_01" used in 36666 faces
   "PDM_CB2_Darbuka_Black_Coffee_Table_Material_02" used in 178 faces
   "PDM_CB2_Darbuka_Black_Coffee_Table_Material_01" used in 538 faces
   "PDM_Dania_Furniture_Bolig_Coffee_Table_Material_02" used in 264 faces
   "PDM_Dania_Furniture_Bolig_Coffee_Table_Material_03" used in 51 faces
   "PDM_Dania_Furniture_Bolig_Coffee_Table_Material_01" used in 144 faces
   "PDM Rubber VP_Carpet_18" used in 5 faces
   "PDM_Dania_Furniture_Insigna_High_Chest_Material_02" used in 4596 faces
   "PDM_Dania_Furniture_Insigna_Nightstand_Material_02" used in 252 faces
   "PDM_Dania_Furniture_Insigna_Nightstand_Material_01" used in 112 faces
   "PDM_Dania_Furniture_Insigna_High_Chest_Material_01" used in 556 faces
   "PDM_Dania_Furniture_Adalina_High_Chest_Material_02" used in 622 faces
   "PDM_Living_Divani_Galileo_Decorative_Pendulum_Material_01" used in 248 faces
   "PDM_Living_Divani_Galileo_Decorative_Pendulum_Material_02" used in 1 face
   "PDM_Living_Divani_Galileo_Decorative_Pendulum_Material_03" used in 6 faces
   "PDM_Living_Divani_Ceiba_Coat_Hanger_Material_07" used in 3030 faces
   "PDM_Dania_Furniture_Gustav_Ottoman_Material_01" used in 104 faces
   "PDM_Dania_Furniture_Gustav_Ottoman_Material_02" used in 8311 faces
   "PDM Steel VP_Candlestick" used in 16 faces
   "PDM Glass VP_Candlestick" used in 4 faces
   "PDM Wood VP_Candlestick" used in 36 faces
   "PDM White VP_Candlestick" used in 738 faces
   "PDM_Mirror_22_Material_02" used in 22200 faces
   "PDM_Mirror_22_Material_01" used in 49 faces
   "PDM White VP_Picture_47" used in 21 faces
   "PDM Black plastic VP_Picture_1" used in 33 faces
   "PDM Bird VP_Picture_47" used in 1 face
   "Material4" used in 1 face
   "PDM White glass VP_Cups_02" used in 4428 faces
   "WoodFine0014_S" used in 189 faces
   "orange_peel1" used in 1400 faces
   "banana" used in 2306 faces
   "PDM_Knives_set_01_Antique_Spruce_01" used in 781 faces
   "PDM_Knives_set_01_Stainless_Steel" used in 88 faces
   "PDM_Knives_set_01_chrome3" used in 745 faces
   "PDM_Osaka_Cafetiere_Double_Walled_Glass_French_Press_Material_03" used in 316 faces
   "PDM_Osaka_Cafetiere_Double_Walled_Glass_French_Press_Material_02" used in 16337 faces
   "PDM_Nambe_Bulbo_Kettle_Material_01" used in 2237 faces
   "PDM_Nambe_Bulbo_Kettle_Material_03" used in 96 faces
   "PDM_Catskill_Craftsmen_Super_Slab_Cutting_Board_Material_01" used in 2 faces
   "PDM_BergHOFF_Cubo_2_Pc_Bread_Bin_Material_02" used in 74 faces
   "PDM_BergHOFF_Cubo_2_Pc_Bread_Bin_Material_01" used in 367 faces
   "PDM_Skull_Candle_Material_02" used in 7058 faces
   "PDM_Skull_Candle_Material_01" used in 97 faces

Materials with refraction:
   "PDM_Door_08_material_07" used in 4432 faces
   "PDM_LG_65in_Class_OLED_2160p_Smart_4K_Ultra_HD_TV_Material_09" used in 2211 faces
   "PDM_LG_65in_Class_OLED_2160p_Smart_4K_Ultra_HD_TV_Material_11" used in 629 faces
   "PDM_Harbour_Outdoor_Breeze_Armchair_Material_03" used in 1022 faces
   "PDM_Nambe_Bulbo_Kettle_Material_03" used in 96 faces


GENERAL MODEL INFO
==================================

Operating System: Windows 8.1 or Windows Server 2012 R2
Sketchup Version: 17.2.2555
SU Podium Version: 5.606
There are 330815 faces, 362 materials, 3 pages, 22 layers, 0 groups and 267 component instances in the model.
Sipmasternasty

Registered:
Posts: 5
Reply with quote  #5 
So I have tried both adding a new user, and trying to render with that user and it still crashes.

I have also looked to rollback the GPU drive, but it doesn't give me the option to do so. Would this be because it is so new? 

What could I do next?
Nick00

Avatar / Picture

Maître érudit
Registered:
Posts: 3,277
Reply with quote  #6 
I would personally generate a rendering file, close everything, disable the GPU, then open the rendering manager and render the file. You'd be sure this way the GPU is not interfering.
__________________
Podium Tech. Support
bigstick

Avatar / Picture

Moderator
Registered:
Posts: 10,106
Reply with quote  #7 
What make is this machine?

Did you buy it from a recognised manufacturer, or did you build it yourself or have it custom built?

If it's the latter, that's the issue with custom machines - they can be prone to all sorts of weird and obscure conflicts. Years ago I used to build my own machines, and I had exactly this kind of problem. Different drivers and chipsets can create weird glitches that can be impossible to nail down.

This is why I would never recommend anything other than a machine from a well-established reputable vendor. They know which hardware and software works reliably together. They test this stuff at length. Business class machines cost more, and are under-specced compared with consumer machines, but they are more reliable.

Lots of so-called experts can build machines that ought to work, however the potential for little conflicts and inconsistencies is huge. Even a BIOS configuration could cause instability.

This is one of the reasons I abandoned PCs and went to Macs. They are not without their problems, but they are generally a lot more reliable.

You've got a lot of reflective materials there, and quite a lot of refractive ones too! You have a high specification machine, so it ought to be able to cope.

System configuration issues and conflicts can be almost impossible to debug...

__________________

That which does not kill us makes us stronger
-Friedrich Nietzsche

Sipmasternasty

Registered:
Posts: 5
Reply with quote  #8 
Nick00: Thanks for your suggestion, I did try this and still crashed. So musn't be the GPU. 

bigstick: I bought it from YOYOTECH, who are an official retailer of BOXX but also sell their own brand. They said that they would spec exactly the same workstation as BOXX but it just wouldn't have their label on it... I think I will try and return it. I have been speaking to Podium, and they have my model and they don't see a problem with it, so maybe it is the hardware...

If I can return it, I may consider a MAC, are they good enough for rendering? The reason for choosing a PC was because I didn't think the MAC could be spec'd high enough to render well. What spec would I be looking at to handle large model sizes? 


bigstick

Avatar / Picture

Moderator
Registered:
Posts: 10,106
Reply with quote  #9 
Yoyotech are reputable, but they are not a huge name manufacturer. BOXX I would definitely trust, but I suspect that the Yoyotech machine isn't quite identical. Bear in mind that the BOXX machine would come fully configured with the optimal drivers.

Of course it may always be that you have an issue with a current driver, and that the hardware spec is fine. This is the trouble with Windows and PC architecture. There are so many permutations of different components, all based on reference documents and drivers, but manufacturers periodically optimise these, in ways that can sometimes cause conflicts.

You only find out when stuff stops working as it ought.

Macs are fine at rendering - but it depends what you want. The 2013 Mac Pro is a very capable machine, even though it hasn't been upgraded properly for 5 years. The only issue with it is its price, which is totally OTT for what you are buying.

Each year at the AIA convention, I demo with a 2015 core i7 MacBook Pro, which is a fabulous machine! it's fast, it's light and portable, it has great battery life and graphics performance (for a laptop), and best of all, you can pick them up quite cheaply second hand.

Macs hold their value, and keep working for years longer than their PC counterparts. I'm using a 2013 MacBook Air, and in the office, my 2008 Mac Pro has only just failed, after pretty much flawless performance at the same level as when I bought it.

The iMac Pro, coming at the end of the year will be a truly awesome render machine. It's also entirely comparable terms of price (from what the stated price is), with similarly specced PCs. I hope to replace my Mac Pro with one of those in a few months.

I appreciate it's a long time to wait, but you could always buy a 2015 MacBook Pro, keep it for 6 months, and sell it when the iMac Pro comes out. I doubt you'll lose much money on it - if any.

__________________

That which does not kill us makes us stronger
-Friedrich Nietzsche

Sipmasternasty

Registered:
Posts: 5
Reply with quote  #10 
Thanks for the advice Bigstick. 

I am send the computer back to be checked, they have suggested it might need more memory, perhaps another 32gb, but I am not sure that is the answer. Think they just might be wanting more money???

They have said that I can access the workstation remotely whilst its in the workshop, so I will run the render and see what results come from the crash. Fingers crossed it gets sorted. 

Will definitely consider the mac pro, had a look at it and it looks very good indeed. Quite pricey, but I can imagine worth the money when things are hassle free. 
bigstick

Avatar / Picture

Moderator
Registered:
Posts: 10,106
Reply with quote  #11 
It's not likely to be a RAM issue!

330K polygons should be no problem for 16Gb of RAM. You should be able to render that with a MacBook Pro.

Try setting resolution to 640x480 and see if that works. if you have a 4K or UHD monitor, don't render to screen resolution. Choose the size you need. Most people don't need the high resolutions they render to. 

There have been long discussions regarding 300dpi on these forums. In almost every case I think it's totally unnecessary. It kills your render time and productivity unless you have a dedicated render server.





__________________

That which does not kill us makes us stronger
-Friedrich Nietzsche

Previous Topic | Next Topic
Print
Reply

Quick Navigation: